Welcome to the forum, it'll be nice to have an architects opinion here.
Just to clarify the St Joe and Washington project I was talking about a few posts ago was this project:
I assume you're talking about the old Deluxe Inn site? It's listed as "Gateway to REO Town", I agree the site has potential, but development is still slow to get going in downtown Lansing, especially west of the river. I'm sure once things get rolling the site won't stay vacant for long. It's set up in a very good location and the way it sits so high above the river gives the opportunity to do something interesting there. Studio intrigue did a visionary proposal awhile back for the Land Bank:
@Lymon89 On another note I'd love to solicit your opinion on something I've been working on for a little while (I posted this awhile back in the Off-topic thread also). It's an imaginary project that would redevelop the factory complex at Mt Hope and Washington. It's a SketchUp file hosted on my Dropbox, if you or anyone else gets a chance to look at it I'd love your opinion and I'd be happy to try to explain what all I have going on in the plan.
@hood, I actually remember seeing that post a while back and thinking it was an interesting idea and a location I had never really though much about. I think it was around the time I was choosing a site for this studio course.
I agree, it's a site that's going to be a little ways down the road given REOtown is still in the process of "filling up" so to speak. The entire district was something I actually studied as well since there are blocks that have still had minimal to no renovations while others have been mostly renovated. It was all to justify "why build new" when there is still work to be done in REOtown. The idea was it would be a "bookend" so to speak to encourage the rest and act as a gateway ideally drawing more people into the district.
Anyways, yeah, I'd be more than happy to look at the model and offer my opinions.
Thanks, I'm scraping up against the limits of my creativity and SketchUp skills. The project centers around converting that rail line to a road from at least Washington to MLK. The Old drop forge building on the West side of that road would be a new City Market, more akin to Detroit's Eastern Market. The multi floor buildings would be mixed use, there's many, many possible uses for all that space. There'd also be plenty of room for new construction if there were ever demand.
I think it may actually be a viable/practical project if Atmosphere Annealing and QD would part with their properties at a reasonable price.
I grew up close enough to that drop forge that it was a summer sound that you would hear with the windows open, it was not an unpleasant sound, a very steady curr -chunk curr-chunk that could put me to sleep. That was a Lansing sound 50 years ago.
It would be great to see the area developed. There are some nice neighborhoods that surround the area that would benefit. I think a Lansing type neighborhood would be great with light industry and commercial building mixed right in with residential buildings. I think the buildings would do best by being right up next to the streets with parking on the back side of any building. So as not to look like a suburban office/industrial park. I think although nice, it was a mistake to develop the REO site like that. There could have been all the businesses that are there now lining Washington and Baker with some nice housing and commercial mixed in. I think that would be the way to go at Washington and Mt Hope. The area at Holmes and Washington/ MLK area is also just kind of awful,and someone once mentioned here would make a good site for a"town center" type development. It would be nice to see the south side looking as good as the north side.
This is also just an dream idea but it would be cool if there was maybe a cute little real trolley {on rails} think Lisbon or Rio, that goes up and down Washington connecting Lansing's classic neighborhoods. Old town, Downtown and REO town maybe on up to Holmes. It would serve as a tourist attraction and as transportation for those neighborhoods. People would like to ride it just because it is fun, bringing them right into our neighborhood businesses. Short of a rail trolley maybe a classic bus line with refurbished cool old buses from the 30's up to the 60's. If you were in Old Town and wanted to eat lunch in REO town just hop on the classic bus. The buses would play into our motor culture. They should be real not ye'olde trolley type things.
I imagine living in that area was noisy at times with at least three drop forges operating so close to each other. Now only the one on Dunlap is still drop forge, and it hardly seemed to be running when I was regularly in that area from about 2-4 years ago.
I'm still disappointed that they tore down all of the REO buildings in the first place. That would of made for a truly interesting redevelopment opportunity. I wholeheartedly agree with you on what they replaced it with, especially the suburban style office buildings facing Washington.
As for that trolley, the issue becomes putting rails in the street. I'd be willing to bet it would cost virtually as much as light rail, likely making it unrealistic for the time being. I would love to see a BRT/light rail/trolley line going down Washington at least as far as Mt Hope though, it may happen someday.
It was noisy, the drop forges would open their doors and you could not only hear but see the forge working and sparks flying. I thought it was cool to see. Also in the summer you could see inside many factories as most had big doors and windows. The trains would couple and uncouple right next to Olds across the river, you would hear a big bang and a bang bang bang bang as the impact of the coupling ran through the line of rail cars. If the wind was from the south you could smell the bread baking at Shaffer's bakery which was nice, but, I went to Sexton, and sometimes the paint fumes from Fisher Body were pretty bad and would give you a headache if the wind was from the north. The river itself smelled bad when they would let all the hot water go into the river it smelled like well boiled chemical water, which would be very strong at Moores Park Pool some times. Traffic on Logan was wild and dangerous especially at shift change. All these things seemed normal at the time.
These days are so much better in regards to noise traffic and air pollution. It's hard to tell anything is going on at the GM plant now with it's big white boxes except for the lines of new cars in the lots. It is not the best thing that has happen losing the jobs there, but I would bet that the people who live on the west side by Sexton do not miss the smell of paint fumes. The trains just rumble through now the horns do seem loader. I like I can see and hear the trains from where I live. The river is so much cleaner now and just smells like water. The only air pollution I have noticed since returning would be smoke from western fires. The air in the mornings smells green and fresh it smells like Michigan which these days is very good. I think that this could be a draw for tourist from the overcrowded polluted Asia. Come and see our industry work in the middle of our green urban forest.
Yeah, even in my lifetime the river has gotten much cleaner, largely due to CSO work. I've heard many people say how bad the paint smell from Fisher Body was, I'm glad the new factories don't seem to emit any smells at all.
I believe they fixed it after years of the neighborhoods complaining, but the paint shop at Lansing Grand River used to be horrible with odors. I don't live down that way, but when I used to be down there fairly regularly on the River Trail the acrid chemical smell from the paint shop was absolutely terrible, enough to burn your throat and make you dizzy. You'd often catch a bit of the smell around Moores Park, but since the winds mostly blow in from the west the worst of the smell over REO Town and River Point.
East Lansing approved a contract to allow them to use Lansing's recycling facilities creating Capital Area Recycling and Trash. Good to see this little piece of regionalism enacted.
East Lansing Mayor Nathan Triplett tells 6 News that the pilot program will help the two regions transition to curbside single stream recycling, which benefits both residents and local environment.
The shared facilities will include a recycling transfer station, hauling operations and a material recycling facility.
East Lansing’s recycling materials will begin arriving in Lansing on Monday.
The new curbside bins will be delivered the week the week of September 28.
Comments
Just to clarify the St Joe and Washington project I was talking about a few posts ago was this project:
I assume you're talking about the old Deluxe Inn site? It's listed as "Gateway to REO Town", I agree the site has potential, but development is still slow to get going in downtown Lansing, especially west of the river. I'm sure once things get rolling the site won't stay vacant for long. It's set up in a very good location and the way it sits so high above the river gives the opportunity to do something interesting there. Studio intrigue did a visionary proposal awhile back for the Land Bank:
Dropbox link
I agree, it's a site that's going to be a little ways down the road given REOtown is still in the process of "filling up" so to speak. The entire district was something I actually studied as well since there are blocks that have still had minimal to no renovations while others have been mostly renovated. It was all to justify "why build new" when there is still work to be done in REOtown. The idea was it would be a "bookend" so to speak to encourage the rest and act as a gateway ideally drawing more people into the district.
Anyways, yeah, I'd be more than happy to look at the model and offer my opinions.
I think it may actually be a viable/practical project if Atmosphere Annealing and QD would part with their properties at a reasonable price.
It would be great to see the area developed. There are some nice neighborhoods that surround the area that would benefit. I think a Lansing type neighborhood would be great with light industry and commercial building mixed right in with residential buildings. I think the buildings would do best by being right up next to the streets with parking on the back side of any building. So as not to look like a suburban office/industrial park. I think although nice, it was a mistake to develop the REO site like that. There could have been all the businesses that are there now lining Washington and Baker with some nice housing and commercial mixed in. I think that would be the way to go at Washington and Mt Hope. The area at Holmes and Washington/ MLK area is also just kind of awful,and someone once mentioned here would make a good site for a"town center" type development. It would be nice to see the south side looking as good as the north side.
This is also just an dream idea but it would be cool if there was maybe a cute little real trolley {on rails} think Lisbon or Rio, that goes up and down Washington connecting Lansing's classic neighborhoods. Old town, Downtown and REO town maybe on up to Holmes. It would serve as a tourist attraction and as transportation for those neighborhoods. People would like to ride it just because it is fun, bringing them right into our neighborhood businesses. Short of a rail trolley maybe a classic bus line with refurbished cool old buses from the 30's up to the 60's. If you were in Old Town and wanted to eat lunch in REO town just hop on the classic bus. The buses would play into our motor culture. They should be real not ye'olde trolley type things.
I'm still disappointed that they tore down all of the REO buildings in the first place. That would of made for a truly interesting redevelopment opportunity. I wholeheartedly agree with you on what they replaced it with, especially the suburban style office buildings facing Washington.
As for that trolley, the issue becomes putting rails in the street. I'd be willing to bet it would cost virtually as much as light rail, likely making it unrealistic for the time being. I would love to see a BRT/light rail/trolley line going down Washington at least as far as Mt Hope though, it may happen someday.
These days are so much better in regards to noise traffic and air pollution. It's hard to tell anything is going on at the GM plant now with it's big white boxes except for the lines of new cars in the lots. It is not the best thing that has happen losing the jobs there, but I would bet that the people who live on the west side by Sexton do not miss the smell of paint fumes. The trains just rumble through now the horns do seem loader. I like I can see and hear the trains from where I live. The river is so much cleaner now and just smells like water. The only air pollution I have noticed since returning would be smoke from western fires. The air in the mornings smells green and fresh it smells like Michigan which these days is very good. I think that this could be a draw for tourist from the overcrowded polluted Asia. Come and see our industry work in the middle of our green urban forest.
Not that these rankings matter, but here's a feel good story from the LSJ: Lansing ranked best in U.S. in education quality, attainment