If we are going to lay some blame, one could go all the way back the the Reagan era. This was the time when the federal government began the turning away from cities and states. Those years the feds. rang up huge red ink with tax cuts and military spending. The Washington money tap started to be turned off and all the structures that were built with that money were now looked at in a different way. The mantra of getting government out of our lives was elevated to an almost religious doctrine. This dream still lives in the minds of so called conservatives. Trickle down, privatization, free market, unbridled capitalism would take over and solve every problem with a private money making and finding all the solutions. Ask the people in Flint and Detroit how that worked out. The effort to sell the Board of Water and Light and WKAR could have been just another stop on that train. I am so happy we did not go that way.
I may be boring everyone with my Lansing in the past stories, in the 60's it wasn't perfect, but Lansing was almost socialist. Every neighborhood had a park, every park had flowers, and gardens. In tiny Quentin Park there were rock gardens, a sledding hill, a natural ramble, a big playground. tennis and basketball courts and softball fields. PeeWee football in the fall, ice skating in the winter, and activity counselors who lead games and arts and crafts activities in the summer. Every neighborhood had an elementary school that children could walk to. In school we were provided with everything right down to pencils and paper. Sports music the arts and civics were include at every level, there were no extra fees to be on a team or in the band.Every school had a nurse, the county would bring in dentist to give fluoride treatments. I could be wrong but I think the city had the capacity to rebuild roads itself, and I honestly don't remember the streets ever looking like Michigan Ave and many others look today. Many people had union jobs which provided many benefits such as health care and pensions that allowed people to spend their money elsewhere. Working in the public sector was honored and a good paying job. People who just worked on the line owned their homes drove nice cars had a cottage up north with boats and snowmobiles. In other words it all functioned quite well the people were happy and the city was taken care of. All of this was vilified, even hated by the conservative movement. Corporations like GM were badly mismanaged and their salutation was to move production to ever cheaper labor markets. Leaving behind the skilled laborers who were some of GM's best costumers. How did that work out? I still don't understand why the plan seems to be the opposite of their "image" as defenders of the family and country. Poverty and low wages mean people have to work more, be away from home and not raising their children. They can not participate in civic or community life and decisions. If you want to blame something I think the conservative movement is right up there with corporate greed as reasons we find ourselves in our current state. The fact that Lansing is doing pretty well despite all the winds blowing against us is a testament to the fact that in Lansing many people still have good jobs and have belief that community is important and that Lansing is a nice place to live. I would however wish that Lansing would give up the mindset that we have to beg for any development and be grateful for what ever we get. If we were to say beautify the whole city I mean really go for it with flowers trees, nice paved streets, clean rivers and streams, an elegant modern looking transit fleet and system. That alone would could create a frame for much more tourism, which leads to more businesses, more people with good jobs, more taxes being paid. How capitalist! The private sector is never going to pave our streets or beautify our parks, people with money to pay taxes will. It seems to me putting money in peoples hands means more profits for business.The conservative austerity policies are proven failures yet they keep trying to sell that same old horse. Well I guess that was my rant on the subject, if we want change we have to be involved, and I am grateful that this forum is one place to do that.
Hood - I agree with you on Snyder. Though, I personally think the world is too complex for libertarianism.
And to both of you - I don't think that Lansing is on as bad a track as this discussion suggests. The City might not be paying directly for projects but they are doing a good job of working with the County and private entities. Here are a few things I've been impressed with over the past ten years:
-Improvements and extensions to the River Trail make this hands-down the best paved trail network in the entire State....and probably best in the Midwest. It's totally underrated.
-Hawk Island Park - this place is amazing!
-Great improvements to the Zoo (though I miss the old rock structures)
-Streetscaping and stormwater management on Michigan (Pennsylvania to the Capital) and on Washington Square
-Tollgate drain park north of Oakland - this is so cool
-Hunter Park improvements
-Old town has blown up the way no one would have expected 15 years ago
-REO town now exists in people's minds and in general, neighborhoods seems to have more definition than they ever did before
These are mostly landscape/public space projects but they have a much greater impact on quality of life for residents than the convention center or even the stadium. These are all pragmatic, intelligent projects that took a lot of planning and vision and conversations. On that note, the City's master plan update and BRT work are two major planning initiatives that have produced meaningful discussion and vision for the area.
In terms of private development:
-Accident Trust Fund is one of the most impressive renovation projects this country has seen (it would stand out in NY or Chicago)
-Knapps and Arbough, amazing that these two building have been reborn. Knapps particularly may be the most unique building in MI
-The Capital looks gorgeous
-Washington Sq has more life than I've ever seen
-LCC's doing amazing things
-Prudden
-BWL Coogeneration plant
-Marshall Street Armory (i'm shocked Lansing hasn't gotten a lot more cred for historic preservation)
-Major expansion of Sparrow
-Major renovations to stadium
-5 or 6 Gillespie projects that fill a necessary niche for urban living
-There must be 7-10 four-story apartment buildings in the works (these are the lifeblood of viable cities)
-EL is still ten years behind the successful college towns, but MSU has done a pretty good job developing
-We've got an f'ing Zaha Hadid museum here!
Still plenty of room for improvement (and I totally agree about the need for an art/performance center in Lansing) but 15 years ago this region was a sprawling shit-show. Let's please not ever go back to that.
@gbinlansing I don't want to go too much further down the political rabbit hole than I already have, so I'll just say that liberalism and conservatism are two sides of the same coin and both ideologies would be capable of destroying this country if implemented in their entirety. Getting away from the idea that we only have two choices in government is crucial to improving politics and government, especially at the federal level.
As for stories about the Lansing of old, I always enjoy learning some local history whether it's you or a family member telling it. I does make me a little depressed to know what once was though, especially regarding the parks and city services.
@MJ I'd agree that the world is too complex for libertarianism as a whole, that's why I always specify 'civil' libertarian (even that may be too broad a brush to paint myself with). Obviously our society is nowhere near mature enough to handle total freedom (aka anarchy), but I do think it should be a (very, very) long term goal. One thing's for certain, the federal government and politics in general are completely broken in this country and I haven't heard a reasonable solution from anyone, I can't think of one and it's something I think about quite a bit.
All of your positive points on Lansing are very much valid, I admittedly focus too much on the negative side of everything, I'm a critic at heart. I still stand by all my negative points though, this city is positioned to do much better than it has been and I still think this area needs to be far more ambitious if we're ever going to capitalize on all those positive things you mentioned.
@MichMatters I'm interested in how far they go with their renovation of that building at Kalamazoo & Hosmer. I wonder if they'll keep that vinyl-clad wall as is and I especially wonder if there's any chance at all of exposing the original brick facade.
I will not get politics into the discussion again unless the thoughts posted go that way. It's just hard to watch these bad things happen in my Michigan and my Lansing. I have always been proud of being from Lansing Michigan. I would always defended Michigan against all detractors in the years I lived out east, they would ask, "where are you from?" Canada? Fargo? when they detected my Michigander accent. When I told them "whrah" I was from most people's face would kind of drop generally ignorant of Michigan, except for "poor Detroit" and frozen wilderness. I told people I am from Lansing, I swear many people out there did not know Lansing is the Capital of Michigan.By the time I left two bars there always have the Spartans on when ever they play. My point is that I really love Lansing and am so happy to be home. I am really amazed at the positive changes in the city. I use the river trail and go to Hawk Island, I shop and eat downtown, I live in REOtown, I think it is all really great. I too just want developers and politicians to love Lansing as much as I do and build amazing buildings that people will love and pave the streets so we can drive our new Cadillac's and Camaro's.
I also have noticed something going on in that newly black warehouse building on Kalamazoo. There are new vent pipes on the roof and wires for I would guess outdoor lighting sticking out of the Kalamazoo street walls. It will be interesting to find out what is going in there and why they painted it all black. The building down the street on Michigan looks really good.
As long as it's built up to the street, uses quality materials, has a good design and includes at least some ground floor retail I'd be happy with this, four floors is about the minimum height I'd like to see but I'm pretty happy about it being a hotel. The Deluxe Inn was the way it was partially because of its design and partially because it wasn't a name brand and had neglectful operators. A well managed chain hotel should have no problem succeeding at this site, it's in downtown and has easy access to MSU. Downtown/central Lansing desperately needs more hotels, if this proposal's design and site layout are good I really hope it happens.
On the subject of which chain, there's too many options to offer a good guess. There are several extended stay chains currently in the Lansing area, the ones I know of are Staybridge, Candlewood, TownPlace and Residence Inn. Here's a list of chains: Lint of extended stay hotel chains - Wikipedia. Hilton's been making a push into Lansing so perhaps it's them.
I just read that the BWL has already made up their minds about the site of the new substation. I am glad to hear that that there are folks who are questioning this plan. The meetings with the neighborhood will be to discuss the exterior wall treatments, which seems to say it's going in there and there is not anything we can do about it. Like I have said before put it in the GM parking lot not in a city park. There are very nice mature pines that you can see from way up the street, some of them are quite unique. It will be a shame to see the day they cut all those trees down. It seems especially here in Lansing that history has no place in the path of progress. This connects REOtown to Downtown? How?
Across the street the hotel plan sounds OK, like hood said, lets hope it has some sort of urban design that really does connect with Downtown.
The hotel locating here may also have to do with the borders of downtown and the chokehold that the Radisson has on it. $4m actually sounds pretty cheap though for 4 stories. I don't expect any ground floor retail will be included unless the city required it and I don't see them mentioning that anywhere.
Yeah, not a destination hotel or even something to compete with the Marriott in East Lansing or Radisson downtown. At least a hotel with a rooftop bar or fancy restaurant included would be a compromise.
There's also a couple of interesting 'Letters from the Mayor' regarding PILOT programs for "Capitol Park Center" and "Walnut Park Apartments", the actual letters are replaced by "not available at time of print" text so who knows what these actually are (The Abagail was another one of these PILOT programs on the list but we know what that one is.) These names aren't already attached to any known project are they?
There's also a transfer of liquor license to Mega-Bev Inc at 3630 S Cedar. This is the old L&L/Daily Deals at Rouse & Cedar, I'd love to see this building get back to use as I grew up less than a block from it. Mega-Bev is a company out of Battle Creek and it looks like they run large liquor stores: Mega-Bev
Comments
I may be boring everyone with my Lansing in the past stories, in the 60's it wasn't perfect, but Lansing was almost socialist. Every neighborhood had a park, every park had flowers, and gardens. In tiny Quentin Park there were rock gardens, a sledding hill, a natural ramble, a big playground. tennis and basketball courts and softball fields. PeeWee football in the fall, ice skating in the winter, and activity counselors who lead games and arts and crafts activities in the summer. Every neighborhood had an elementary school that children could walk to. In school we were provided with everything right down to pencils and paper. Sports music the arts and civics were include at every level, there were no extra fees to be on a team or in the band.Every school had a nurse, the county would bring in dentist to give fluoride treatments. I could be wrong but I think the city had the capacity to rebuild roads itself, and I honestly don't remember the streets ever looking like Michigan Ave and many others look today. Many people had union jobs which provided many benefits such as health care and pensions that allowed people to spend their money elsewhere. Working in the public sector was honored and a good paying job. People who just worked on the line owned their homes drove nice cars had a cottage up north with boats and snowmobiles. In other words it all functioned quite well the people were happy and the city was taken care of. All of this was vilified, even hated by the conservative movement. Corporations like GM were badly mismanaged and their salutation was to move production to ever cheaper labor markets. Leaving behind the skilled laborers who were some of GM's best costumers. How did that work out? I still don't understand why the plan seems to be the opposite of their "image" as defenders of the family and country. Poverty and low wages mean people have to work more, be away from home and not raising their children. They can not participate in civic or community life and decisions. If you want to blame something I think the conservative movement is right up there with corporate greed as reasons we find ourselves in our current state. The fact that Lansing is doing pretty well despite all the winds blowing against us is a testament to the fact that in Lansing many people still have good jobs and have belief that community is important and that Lansing is a nice place to live. I would however wish that Lansing would give up the mindset that we have to beg for any development and be grateful for what ever we get. If we were to say beautify the whole city I mean really go for it with flowers trees, nice paved streets, clean rivers and streams, an elegant modern looking transit fleet and system. That alone would could create a frame for much more tourism, which leads to more businesses, more people with good jobs, more taxes being paid. How capitalist! The private sector is never going to pave our streets or beautify our parks, people with money to pay taxes will. It seems to me putting money in peoples hands means more profits for business.The conservative austerity policies are proven failures yet they keep trying to sell that same old horse. Well I guess that was my rant on the subject, if we want change we have to be involved, and I am grateful that this forum is one place to do that.
Hood - I agree with you on Snyder. Though, I personally think the world is too complex for libertarianism.
And to both of you - I don't think that Lansing is on as bad a track as this discussion suggests. The City might not be paying directly for projects but they are doing a good job of working with the County and private entities. Here are a few things I've been impressed with over the past ten years:
-Improvements and extensions to the River Trail make this hands-down the best paved trail network in the entire State....and probably best in the Midwest. It's totally underrated.
-Hawk Island Park - this place is amazing!
-Great improvements to the Zoo (though I miss the old rock structures)
-Streetscaping and stormwater management on Michigan (Pennsylvania to the Capital) and on Washington Square
-Tollgate drain park north of Oakland - this is so cool
-Hunter Park improvements
-Old town has blown up the way no one would have expected 15 years ago
-REO town now exists in people's minds and in general, neighborhoods seems to have more definition than they ever did before
These are mostly landscape/public space projects but they have a much greater impact on quality of life for residents than the convention center or even the stadium. These are all pragmatic, intelligent projects that took a lot of planning and vision and conversations. On that note, the City's master plan update and BRT work are two major planning initiatives that have produced meaningful discussion and vision for the area.
In terms of private development:
-Accident Trust Fund is one of the most impressive renovation projects this country has seen (it would stand out in NY or Chicago)
-Knapps and Arbough, amazing that these two building have been reborn. Knapps particularly may be the most unique building in MI
-The Capital looks gorgeous
-Washington Sq has more life than I've ever seen
-LCC's doing amazing things
-Prudden
-BWL Coogeneration plant
-Marshall Street Armory (i'm shocked Lansing hasn't gotten a lot more cred for historic preservation)
-Major expansion of Sparrow
-Major renovations to stadium
-5 or 6 Gillespie projects that fill a necessary niche for urban living
-There must be 7-10 four-story apartment buildings in the works (these are the lifeblood of viable cities)
-EL is still ten years behind the successful college towns, but MSU has done a pretty good job developing
-We've got an f'ing Zaha Hadid museum here!
Still plenty of room for improvement (and I totally agree about the need for an art/performance center in Lansing) but 15 years ago this region was a sprawling shit-show. Let's please not ever go back to that.
As for stories about the Lansing of old, I always enjoy learning some local history whether it's you or a family member telling it. I does make me a little depressed to know what once was though, especially regarding the parks and city services.
@MJ I'd agree that the world is too complex for libertarianism as a whole, that's why I always specify 'civil' libertarian (even that may be too broad a brush to paint myself with). Obviously our society is nowhere near mature enough to handle total freedom (aka anarchy), but I do think it should be a (very, very) long term goal. One thing's for certain, the federal government and politics in general are completely broken in this country and I haven't heard a reasonable solution from anyone, I can't think of one and it's something I think about quite a bit.
All of your positive points on Lansing are very much valid, I admittedly focus too much on the negative side of everything, I'm a critic at heart. I still stand by all my negative points though, this city is positioned to do much better than it has been and I still think this area needs to be far more ambitious if we're ever going to capitalize on all those positive things you mentioned.
@MichMatters I'm interested in how far they go with their renovation of that building at Kalamazoo & Hosmer. I wonder if they'll keep that vinyl-clad wall as is and I especially wonder if there's any chance at all of exposing the original brick facade.
I also have noticed something going on in that newly black warehouse building on Kalamazoo. There are new vent pipes on the roof and wires for I would guess outdoor lighting sticking out of the Kalamazoo street walls. It will be interesting to find out what is going in there and why they painted it all black. The building down the street on Michigan looks really good.
On the subject of which chain, there's too many options to offer a good guess. There are several extended stay chains currently in the Lansing area, the ones I know of are Staybridge, Candlewood, TownPlace and Residence Inn. Here's a list of chains: Lint of extended stay hotel chains - Wikipedia. Hilton's been making a push into Lansing so perhaps it's them.
Across the street the hotel plan sounds OK, like hood said, lets hope it has some sort of urban design that really does connect with Downtown.
There's also a transfer of liquor license to Mega-Bev Inc at 3630 S Cedar. This is the old L&L/Daily Deals at Rouse & Cedar, I'd love to see this building get back to use as I grew up less than a block from it. Mega-Bev is a company out of Battle Creek and it looks like they run large liquor stores: Mega-Bev